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Optimum Balanced course for PY

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Race Management
Forum Discription: For race officers and competiors to discuss the topic
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12447
Printed Date: 11 Dec 19 at 6:38pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Optimum Balanced course for PY
Posted By: ClubRacer
Subject: Optimum Balanced course for PY
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 12:06am
So whats everyone's go to course when running handicap racing to make it as fair as possible for;
Fast/slow/cats
Assy/sym/Kiteless boats

Theres no limit to space so the legs can be as long as possible (but be realistic....)
No tide, as a course can always be adjusted to allow for it either way
You've got the best safety boat crew in the world and there is no limit to there ability to set the most complex of courses 





Replies:
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 11:27am
Not possible in my opinion.

Just make sure there's plenty of variety over the course of the series, and don't try to stick to a single supposedly perfect course. Ring the changes as much as possible for reaching legs and course configurations, but try to always get a true beat and a true run each week. As for the rest, P courses, triangles, squares, long thin rectangles, irregular quadrilaterals, just mix 'em up.

Most of all try and set a course that will be as much fun as possible for as many competitors as possible in the conditions prevailing that week.

The way to think of it is that PY numbers are calculated from the huge variety of different courses set by all the different clubs round the country, so setting a huge variety of different courses has got to be the best match to the numbers.


Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 11:55am
At my club first leg always a beat, first mark always port, OOD then sets rest of course.
When I am OOD I always go for a fast reaching course, even if it means almost every mark is a Gybe, I have never considered putting a run in.
The buoys are 7 in number and are layed in a oval pattern.


Posted By: Kev M
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 1:08pm
Originally posted by 423zero

At my club first leg always a beat, first mark always port, OOD then sets rest of course.
When I am OOD I always go for a fast reaching course, even if it means almost every mark is a Gybe, I have never considered putting a run in.
The buoys are 7 in number and are layed in a oval pattern.


I hate courses like that personally. Every leg it's just a drag race with no real tactics required except for the beat. The legs might be fun but the racing isn't. Every course should have at least one proper run in my opinion.

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Successfully confusing ambition with ability since 1980.


Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 1:38pm
This of course is the course I set, other OOD's set their own course of course Smile
I like watching Laser's etc planing, if you want run's sail a "Square rigger", well that is what I say. Wink


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 2:11pm
Has to have something of everything, including runs, but some fun reaching will keep those not just out there for a result on handicap coming back for more.

The tactics are certainly in the beats and runs, though.

If I could only have one, then beat, reach, gybe, reach, gybe/bear away onto run down to the Lee mark, then beat back up.

Today, at least. Or maybe a trapezoidal one. Or a figure 8. Or...

Jim's right. Different course every week. But please no fetches!

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: ClubRacer
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 2:38pm
The problem is that reaches are very boat specific but runs and beats are almost completely neutral to the majority 

something like a 'P' as long as the reaches are kept small(proportionately so) to the beat and run. Obviously this benefits the smaller boats and completely stuffs the Cats



Posted By: PeterG
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 2:42pm
At my previous club we gave up trying - and had a W/L for the asymetrics and a triangle for the rest - most of the time.

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Peter
Ex Cont 707
Laser 189635
DY 59


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 3:54pm
Originally posted by ClubRacer

The problem is that reaches are very boat specific but runs and beats are almost completely neutral to the majority 
something like a 'P' as long as the reaches are kept small(proportionately so) to the beat and run. Obviously this benefitsp the smaller boats and completely stuffs the Cats


How are runs not of benefit (at least on a confined lake) to either symmetric spinnakers boats or shroudless singlehanders?

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 3:56pm
Originally posted by ClubRacer

The problem is that reaches are very boat specific but runs and beats are almost completely neutral to the majority 

I really don't think that's true.

If you consider boats that don't plane upwind and aren't fast enough to apparent wind sail downwind then on beats and runs they are basically going to be displacement sailing all the time, and a high wetted area planing type hull will be at a huge disadvantage to a low wetted area semi displacement oriented boat.

And if you consider spinnaker boats then that sort of course favours boats with very large kites that can't sail hot angles over boats with smaller kites that can sail fast on a greater variety of legs.


Posted By: Do Different
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 5:52pm
Nothing is perfect but I reckon what I probably incorrectly call Olympic (triangle, sausage for one lap) gives most a crack at a leg they like.
An unequal trapezoid can also offer similar variety.





Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 6:53pm
Just avoid pure windward-leeward.  There's nothing more tedious to me, even in asymmetrics.  After just a weekend open of them, I'm bored.

Clearly beats and runs are essential, but courses need to test other abilities too, such as fetching a mark with the kite up, and allowing some fun planing on reaches (when the wind permits.  

But basically, I'd second Jim C's recommendation to mix courses up over a series so that every class has its day. No single course can be fair to all.


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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 10 Jul 16 at 7:09pm
We generally have triangle sausage course at Hythe, but that doesn't necessarily limit you if you can influence the rescue boat setting the course, so make the reaches just tight enough to prevent the Merlin using their kite and the beat one sided but with the best side set out in an adverse tide so they have to think about wether to go out there or not.

Or, if it's blowing marginal Contender weather, make the course long and deep so they can't wire downwind, and the longer the better to keep the lasers back in their boxes. But the Merlin might rear up with a course like that so only set it when they're on rescue boat duty.

On the lake, there is no course option to stop Miracles winning save a long tight reach with not much beating and plenty of wind shadows for them to get stuck in.

It's tricky, trying to get a course to suit you, but after a while you come to work it out, then you get in the lead after a blinding start and first beat..

Then you miss a mark.

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